Slaid Cleaves Is The Latest to Be Critical of Country
Austin, TX-based performer Slaid Cleaves is regarded as one of folk/Americana’s premier songwriters, and he’s also regarded amongst his peers as one of music’s most sharpest minds. Cleaves graduated from the prestigious Tufts University as a philosophy and English major, and recently when touring through Chicago in support of his 2013 release Still Fighting The War, Slaid had some critical things to say about mainstream country to the Chicago Sun Times.
“I guess I just can’t stand that bigger-than-life, good ol’ boy kind of country music.” says Cleaves. “It’s all pretty cheesy if you ask me. Whenever I accidentally come across any nationally-recognized music, it turns my stomach pretty much. All the videos are sexed up with people just trying to push buttons and get people all riled up. I have a friend who writes for a living in Nashville, and he tells me that last season it was all about banjos and now it’s all about tailgates and trucks. He tells me you got to hit those notes if you ever want to get your song cut. I mean, c’mon.”
Cleaves continues, “I mean, don’t get me wrong, I appreciate the craft, and sometimes you can just tell that if a particular song had been done acoustically, it could have worked. There are well-crafted songs out there. I don’t know. Let’s just say I am very comfortable being on the tiniest little fringe of country music these days.”
Season of Discontent: A Timeline of Country’s Recent Artist Criticism
Slaid’s comments touch on an important point that is sometimes lost in the back and forths of country music’s culture war. As mainstream country continues its flight from substance, it pushes away potential talent that doesn’t want to be considered “country” because of the stigma surrounding the term. Artists whose primary goal is not commercial but creative would much rather be labeled an independent artist, folk, or Americana than be lumped in with what is called country today. In turn, saying that mainstream country songwriters and performers have no talent becomes a self-fulfilling prophesy.
October 24, 2013 @ 9:20 am
He didn’t say anything at the concert he cancelled on Tuesday in Mankato, MN.Total bummer.
October 24, 2013 @ 12:18 pm
Slaid been down with a nasty bout of lyrangitis just getting back in the saddle. Catch him when he comes back thru great songwriters acoustic set and unknown to lots of folks Slaid as a world class yodler in the vien of the late Big Daddy Don Walser. He is right why not be comfortable being on the fringe at least he makes a living doing music he’s proud of.
October 24, 2013 @ 9:30 am
I feel like it’s been tailgates and trucks “season” for a good three years now.
October 24, 2013 @ 10:17 am
Slaid Cleaves is a true gift to roots music.
October 24, 2013 @ 11:07 am
I hate to see a culture war in country music. Music at its best should bring people together. I also hate to see talented artists ashamed to say that they write and play country. At the same time, I think it is possible to be both creative and financially successful. Nothing in life is a zero sum game. As a listener I understand that musicians have to eat and support themselves, and realize they may have songs I don’t care for, I just weigh the good songs with the bad.
The important point I like to make, and I don’t know Cleaves backstory is writers tend to write from experience. A lot of the writers and singers in Nashville are highly educated and attended college. They come from a middleclass background. Napoleon once said that whatever a man did when he was 19 affected the way he viewed life. So if you were drinking and partying hard at 19 you’re going to romanticized that, and write about getting lucky on a tailgate in a cornfield. If you’re 19 and supporting a family or off fighting on a war your opportunities to write are limited. That’s why I think there seems to be less diversity on country radio. Music is really a young man’s domain. Also, the south has changed so much in the last 40 years. It’s wealthier and better educated so the stories have changed. The chances of finding a Dolly in Atlanta are extremely rare. Maybe we should look to Detroit?
October 24, 2013 @ 12:35 pm
How does the fact that the South is better educated now explain the fact that country music lyrics have gotten stupider?
October 24, 2013 @ 12:51 pm
Education is a distinction of socioeconomic standing. Instead of working in a field all day for 18 hours passing time in your mind telling stories to one’s self. People are now in air conditioned offices facebooking. Just because someone is educated does not make one a good story teller. Infact some of the most well spoken well read people I ever met were high school drop outs that did manual labor. It may be hard for you to understand but I would rather hear a song with soul than hear someone name drop Rabelais and talk about how clever their metaphors are.
October 24, 2013 @ 1:10 pm
Interesting theory. This may be one of the reasons there’s so many great independent country and roots bands coming out of the industrial Midwest.
October 24, 2013 @ 1:45 pm
I absolutely agree that some of the best storytellers are regular hard-working people without much formal education.
My criticism here is against the highly educated songwriters of today. Shouldn’t they know how to at least add some subtlety to their songs?
October 25, 2013 @ 6:52 am
Milk it! If yer in it for the money or fame…ya just gotta “Milk It”! If yer gonna narrow things down to “List” songs and “Truck” songs…this one was both. LABELS SUCK! POP Country SUX, REAL Country don’t. REAL is REAL…even without a “label”.
October 25, 2013 @ 6:05 pm
Kris Kristofferson was a Rhodes scholar with an Oxford education & he did pretty well for himself.
October 25, 2013 @ 5:42 pm
Interesting. I bet some pretty gritty, compelling stories could come out Detroit / the industrial Midwest at the moment.
However, I still think the lack of diversity in commercial country music primarily has to do with corporate control and consolidation in the industry. Call me a lefty if you want, but that’s the truth. There are a million types of songs being written in Nashville, East Nashville, Austin, Detroit, and all over the place, but the writers and performers of said songs simply aren’t going to given the opportunity for equal representation in mainstream media.
Now, to be fair, the Country Musical-Industrial Complex has really always been too conservative, controlling, and exclusive, but a lot of the people in the business of country radio who at least had a knowledge of the history of the genre & its roots were bounced out in the 90’s and 00’s… and don’t hold your breath waiting for Clear Channel, Viacom, or Music Row suddenly taking an interest in such romantic notions.
The sort of good news is that entities like CMT are actually starting to figure out that independent music, Americana, etc is profitable.
October 25, 2013 @ 6:00 pm
And yeah, the songwriters of the commercial country hit parade may be middle class and college-educated, and that might modify the kind of the songs they tend to write to some extent, but I’m skeptical that they’re trying to write from personal experience anyway. It’s not that hard to catch on the formula of commercial country radio & regurgitate it. Like wise, I don’t hang out in dance clubs partying all night, but I could easily write some Top 40 Pop lyrics to that effect. For bro-country it’s the same, but replace “the club” and its urban paraphernalia with hay bales, trucks, & Jack Daniels instead of Molly and so on.
That Dallas Davidson dude claims to write his jacked-up & country ass-shakin’ tunes from the substance of his daily life, but of course it’s possible to truly “write what you know,” but still express yourself in a profoundly stupid way.
October 25, 2013 @ 11:10 pm
*jacked up trucks & country ass-shakin”™ tunes
October 26, 2013 @ 11:40 pm
I agree that corporate consolidation in country music is responsible for at least some of the lack of quality in mainstream country. However, the country music industry in the 1960s was perhaps even more consolidated than today, with RCA and Acuff-Rose controlling almost all mainstream country songwriting and production. How come the quality of country music was so much better in the 1960s than today?
October 27, 2013 @ 4:54 pm
In my peronsal opinion:
While the corporate base may have broadened slightly on the publishing and production side of country music, the massive consolidation and subsequent increase in corporate control that has taken place in the radio industry renders moot the question of what label a particular song belongs to. I don’t want to get too long-winded, but basically the consolidation process that began with the FCC’s loosening of ownership rules in the early 90’s, which was exacerbated by the Telecommunications Act of 1996*, has allowed companies like Clear Channel and Cumulus to purchase scores of local and independent radio stations all over the country, owning many stations in a single market, leading to rigidly-defined playlists that are simulcast in every market, all over the country. This means Clear Channel, Cumulus and the like get to dictate not only what gets played and when, but often exert an inordinate influence over what music gets made in the first place. The mechanisms these companies use to construct their target marketed playlists include sophisticated demographic profiles and consumer market-testing events.
Here’s a clip from the documentary “Before the Music Dies” about Clear Channel:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JZw7XplA8Cs#t=187
Personally, I think mainstream radio has probably always tended towards mediocrity, but the important distinction is that it was that, as a medium, it was at least open enough to allow for individual DJ choices and unique local programming, and could also be influenced by listener requests or invaded by underground and regional movements. Theoretically, if a handful of people requested that Jason Isbell be played on the local country station, he could not only get played, but become popular in certain markets, which might ultimately lead to nation-wide hits and exposure.
October 27, 2013 @ 5:27 pm
* There has been a lot of confusing back and forth stuff in the last decade as the FCC has tried to deregulate radio even more, and groups like the Prometheus Radio Project has pushed back against it, and I’m not quite sure where we stand now but the problem only seems to get worse.
Triggerman pretty much summed it up here:
“Radio stations have been consolidated to control cost, driving real live DJ”™s underground and replacing them with syndicated national shows or pre-formulated satellite feeds that are voiced over by local “DJ”™s” coming in and out of commercial breaks, thus offering little or no locally generated music content. The media has consolidated as well. Many locally-oriented outlets have gone out of business or are facing budget cuts, and the few outlets left rarely dig to find that fresh voice, they want to land one of the big artists that can assure interest by readers.
Bleeding regionalism out of music has meant the mid-size, second tier musician has been squeezed out of the promotion process, and that minor league of musicians where new talent and fresh music perspectives can be found is circling the drain. When combined together, these smaller acts used to generate a sizable amount of album sales. Major movements in music like Grunge, the last significant movement in popular music, started as a regionalized movement that eventually went national and international to boost music interest and sales.”
https://savingcountrymusic.com/fans-not-only-to-blame-for-musics-lost-decade
https://savingcountrymusic.com/clear-channel-radio-cuts-could-effect-country-music-more
//
A lot of the people within the radio industry who actually liked country music and knew its traditions were laid off or replaced during the consolidation era. What really bothers me is that most people just flip past CMT or country radio and see a bunch jackassses shimmying around on a pontoon boat and think, “Damn, country music sucks these days… whatever happened to ‘I shot a man in Reno,’ and all that?” If they’re old enough to remember something like that, that is. Some people probably think whatever pabulum they hear really represents the best country has to offer, and likely have no clue that in many ways the internal structures of the power base behind the music has completely changed and the radio and CMT really aren’t even trying to present “good” music.
Speaking of which, I also mentioned Viacom earlier, and I guess it’s fair to say that TV is the other place where mainstream country fans traditionally get information about music. CMT is owned by Viacom, which is why it’s basically just a “redneck”-branded version of MTV. So again, it’s unlikely that the owners of that network are going to care about the traditions of country, it *will* happily publicize independent country / Americana those genres show themselves to profitable.
http://www.cmtedge.com/
October 24, 2013 @ 11:38 am
want a real slap in the face, to see how far down country music has fallen?
watch/listen to this video from the show “women of country music” 1992
emmylou harris, Trisha Yearwood, Kathy Mattea ,Pam Tillis, Suzie Bogguss, Patty Loveless, sing backup for Mary Chapin Carpenter, tune He thinks he’ll keep her.
with an outstanding band.
then think of what they put out now. I’m starting to think that it’s about more than music.
if you watch, this is a playlist, it’s a few down on the list.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TVL4mDFX3rY&list=RD02H78hVZ7Jcjo
October 24, 2013 @ 2:46 pm
Thanks for posting that video, even though it’s a little depressing to realize how far we have fallen musically in 20 years. I think I have that special on DVD (“Women of Country”), but I think I had to go to ebay to find it. Maybe I’ll watch it this weekend. That’s a lot of talent on one stage! If you look quickly you can spot Jerry Douglas playing dobro.
October 24, 2013 @ 3:15 pm
you are most welcome. There is an amazing assembly of talent on that stage, couldn’t do that these days, from what they’re putting out on the radio. all fluff no substance at all.
And I agree, it’s depressing to think about the difference. just 20 years.
Maybe in a few years, it’ll get back to that level. I hope.
October 24, 2013 @ 3:24 pm
I remember watching that special when it first aired; in fact, I’m still kinda peeved that I didn’t have the foresight at the time to tape it.
Back then, solid song craft was the general rule rather than the exception — you didn’t have to hunt for it or go the fringes / underground for it.
October 25, 2013 @ 6:10 pm
People are hungry for substance. A few years ago that song “The House That Built Me” got praised for its profundity but it probably would have just been a good album cut in the 90’s. The people that dug that song & others like it might be jumping ship on country radio entirely at this point, though.
October 24, 2013 @ 12:08 pm
I’m w/ Mr Cleaves and my taste are on the fringe of country (or the old stuff). Love Slaid Cleaves, Todd Snyder, Lucinda Williams, Ray Wylie Hubbard, James McMurtry, Hayes Carl, Old 97’s…pretty much the Outlaw Country lineup on Sirius. It is the only new music that feels real to me.
October 24, 2013 @ 12:10 pm
Who started this bandwagon of talking against country music? It’s definitely one I’m on board with, but I just think its interesting that in the last month or two everyone is suddenly coming out. Who was the first one to have the balls to do it?
Not so much Slaid Cleaves and the other independent people, because they have the right to talk. But why are the other mainstream people suddenly coming out now. I wonder if these people would have come out before, would people like FGL even have gotten as famous as they have? Why hasn’t anyone cared until now?
October 24, 2013 @ 12:38 pm
I think Kacey Musgraves started it with her criticism of truck songs.
October 24, 2013 @ 1:41 pm
Trigger made a nice timeline of the recent criticism here: https://savingcountrymusic.com/season-of-discontent-a-timeline-of-countrys-recent-artist-criticism
The first criticism that he included was Kacey Musgrave’s as Eric said.
October 24, 2013 @ 2:15 pm
Merle Haggard and George Jones talked about it on places like theboot.com a few years ago. One said something like today’s music isn’t bad but it’s not country so I thought maybe Blake’s “old farts and jackasses” comment was about them. Now more of the music and lyrics is bad and not country just like pop and rap music is or worse, so younger artists radio plays are complaining about it too because it’s gone downhill and fast. More artists mainstream radio doesn’t play are complaining like Rodney Hayden on twitter.
October 24, 2013 @ 12:30 pm
Trigger, Maybe I missed it or maybe he doesn’t interest you but have you ever listened to any of Ray Scott’s music? Semi-successful Independent music artist and sold songwriter. Just wanted to know your thoughts.
October 24, 2013 @ 4:39 pm
We will try to do a Ray Scott review at some point. So many names, so little time.
October 24, 2013 @ 2:42 pm
And Cleaves IS right that there are still plenty of well-crafted songs even still peppering the airwaves at this point in time, which would indeed translate competently to an acoustic form.
For instance, throughout the latter half of 2001 and all of 2012, Jay Joyce was the unmistakable most talked-about producer in mainstream country radio. He was identified the go-to guy and, to his credit, he has an often impressive understanding of how to embed all these various sounds and nuances together without making for a muddled, discombobulated listening experience.
Since then, however, I feel Joey Moi has stolen the spotlight for most of 2013. And where Joyce (usually) represents more of the right idea to take corporate country music from a production and sonic standpoint, Joey Moi represents everything that is toxic. Moi, who is most-known for being the producer of every one of Nickelback’s albums dating back to 2003’s “The Long Road”, is obsessed with hot-and-cold production elements; where he’ll take a token banjo, dash it over a drum loop or hip-hop beat with some processed acoustic guitar for the verses, and by the time you get to the chorus………..WHAM! In-your-face, overdriven generic power chords and a hair-raisin’ wall of sound just for the sake of being loud. All power, no purpose.
Many of the songs Joyce treats and arranges are what I’d consider to be “well-crafted” and would translate very well in acoustic arenas. Heck, many of them already feature earthy acoustic flavors and tints. With Joey Moi, on the other hand, such moments are quite few and far between, and much more often than not come across as studio trickery that would stumble in an intimate setting. And it’s starting to look like the Moi sound is swallowing up more of the overall corporate “country” radio landscape, despite Joyce remaining well-respected and embraced.
Thus, why we have those like Slaid Cleaves to thank for representing the “tiniest little fringe”. =)
I can respect Cleaves for sounding mature and open-minded about more mainstream preferences and selections here, rather than outright bitter and dismissive about anything-and-everything-mainstream-corporate-yada-yada-yada. Because ultimately, any song’s appeal comes down to how intimate, as well as universal, its appeal is. And both within the mainstream and in its most uncharted outskirts, there are “well-crafted” offerings to be found.
October 24, 2013 @ 4:40 pm
Maybe someone should do a run down of Music Row’s current hot producers just like they are doing with songwriters. My guess it is just as much of a cloistered, inbred bunch.
October 25, 2013 @ 1:20 am
And more specifically, most are washed-up former Air Supply cover band rock star wannabes! (Dan Huff, looking at you too! 😉 )
October 25, 2013 @ 6:36 pm
I looked up that Joey Moi guy, and his website has a photo-list of all of his credits. It’s like a hall of fame of atrociousness, in my personal opinion. And yet, I’m completely unsurprised that Nickelback’s producer is the hot guy in pop country radio. It’s all the same warmed-over ProTools sludge. How long until the lead singer of Nickleback goes country?
October 25, 2013 @ 6:37 pm
I forgot the link:
http://joeymoi.com/#credit_section
October 25, 2013 @ 7:02 pm
Nickelback already attempted to crossover onto the country format.
In March 2010, they released “This Afternoon” as the eighth single from their album “Dark Horse”: which follows the frat-boy country hit-making formula to a tee (though remarkably preceding the peak explosion of frat-boy country beginning in the latter half of 2011 in my view).
Mercifully, it didn’t chart (despite the video being a huge hit on CMT).
*
They have also released previous material that either has frat-boy “country” thematic leanings, or has been reinterpreted by country radio vocalists. Travis Triit covered “Should’ve Listened” in 2007, and Bucky Covington covered “Gotta Be Somebody” in 2009.
I could very well find myself eating my own words later, but I really think Kroeger’s vocals will never translate well enough to “country” radio (yes, even by its current standards) for them to have lasting appeal as a crossover act. Despite that, make no mistake………….Nickelback is most arguably the single most influential act in “country” radio circa 2013 A.D.
October 25, 2013 @ 7:37 pm
Oh geez, I vaguely remember that now. I listened to the the track, and you’re right, Chad Kroeger’s vocals are wrong for country. Replace that guy with a different singer, and they’re the next Florida Georgia Line or something.
“Despite that, make no mistake”¦”¦”¦”¦.Nickelback is most arguably the single most influential act in “country” radio circa 2013 A.D.”
Jeepers Creepers.
October 25, 2013 @ 8:48 pm
I hate it just as much as you do, but I honestly believe this. And here’s a re-cap to why I believe this:
*
1) Joey Moi becoming arguably, but quite likely, the most talked about/go-to producer in “country” music in 2013. He is best-known for having produced each of Nickelback’s albums dating back to 2003’s “The Long Road”. Now, he is the producer of Florida-Georgia Line and Jake Owen’s efforts, as well as the rising star Chase Rice. Numerous other established and rising stars have also expressed interest in working with Moi.
2) The fact pretty much one of every three songs charting this year follows the same frat-boy thematic scheme of “This Afternoon”.
3) Chad Kroeger’s personal label, 604 Records, is home to many MOR modern rock acts including Default, Theory of a Deadman and My Darkest Days who regurgitate all of the same frat-boy themes echoed now in “country” music (albeit with much more vulgarity and crassness). Moreover, some of these washed-up acts are now capitalizing on the “country” market, led most notably by Default frontman Dallas Smith’s foray into American “country” music. Nickelback’s DNA are all over his debut American release “Tippin’ Point”………..produced by Joey Moi and written by Florida-Georgia Line.
4) Even beyond 604 Records and Joey Moi’s soundboard, Nickelback have encouraged other washed-up rock acts to reinvent themselves as “country” acts without changing their sound one iota. Parmalee is the most telling example, which are basically a replica of Daughtry, yet “Carolina” is well on its way to possibly being a chart-topping hit. (Is Buckcherry next? =X )
5) Following Nickelback’s abrupt decline in commercial popularity following the release of “Dark Horse”, which also marked the all-around drastic exodus of music even remotely reflecting “rock” from not just Mainstream Top 40 radio, but even Adult Top 40 radio which had long been friendly to suburbia-friendly “rock”. With Nickelback’s decline and no “rock” act coming even close to carrying the torch onward, many followers of Nickelback and related acts suddenly found a lot of similarities in “country”-rocker Jason Aldean, and Aldean essentially continued where Nickelback left off (thus explaining his surprisingly robust record sales each era). The Nickelback connection is less apparent and obvious here, but his success would spawn many not just rock, but rhythmic music-influenced acts including Florida-Georgia Line.
*
Nickelback are as relevant as ever. Only this time, they’re commanding much of the corporate genre behind the stage.
October 26, 2013 @ 12:50 am
I may steal some of these points Noah if I end up writing that producer article. Just letting you know now.
October 29, 2013 @ 2:57 pm
Nickelback.
The guys in nickelback did things the hard way, touring in a van, across canada, which is hellish at the best of times, playing dives, cheap bars, hotel saloons and the like.
When they started to become successful, they were greatly admired.
Now, they’re too successful, and it’s cool to dislike them.
I think they’ve written some great tunes.
And, they grew up in a small town in rural Alberta, and probably are more familiar with country music than most of todays country singers and songwriters.
October 24, 2013 @ 7:53 pm
Great story Trigger. I really like Slaid Cleaves’ honesty and his singing makes me feel happy and hopeful, sort of like when I heard Pete Seeger as a kid.
October 24, 2013 @ 8:32 pm
“As mainstream country continues its flight from substance, it pushes away potential talent that doesn”™t want to be considered “country” because of the stigma surrounding the term.”
Hehe. Not just the artists. Tons of ppl hate to be associated with Country. Admitting to like Country music these days is like asking for mass side-eyes.
Ballou Flu Tiddy Bits | Rawhide And Velvet
October 25, 2013 @ 9:27 am
[…] With a cool name like Slaid, you can say what you want. […]
October 25, 2013 @ 1:55 pm
Wow! This is the first time I’ve heard about him and he is downright fantastic!
October 26, 2013 @ 7:27 pm
Met him and yes I program him.
October 28, 2013 @ 1:37 pm
What a great show saw him last time he was here in Durham (NC) and so many of the singer songwriter concerts I go to have about 5 people there total….every time I’ve seen him the places have been damn near sold out! And he is (of course) dead on with this sentiment.
You / your company are doing a great job and these are the types of behind the scenes things that need to A) be recognized for their integral role & B) implemented for other folks on the same level / circuit I am regularly amazed at the low turnouts at concerts for what I think are pretty “Big Names” (all is relative)
Just wanted to say thanks & keep up the good work!
October 28, 2013 @ 8:39 am
Yeehaw! Go Jumbos : )
October 28, 2013 @ 6:21 pm
I’ll be honest, this is the first I’ve even heard of this guy, I don’t think this will have as big of an impact as other doing this have.
November 5, 2013 @ 8:12 pm
The problem I have with all the comments about the state of country music is ‘Who decides what is good country music’? Somebody is buying those supposedly terrible songs and going to see those supposedly shallow acts. Some might say that all the critics of current country music or the supposed influence of a highly successful rock act like Nickelback are people that are just jealous that they are not on the successful side of the genre. I think Slaid’s most valuable comment is that we should be talking up and supporting the acts that, in our opinion, are deserving of wider recognition instead of trying to talk down the current state of country music.
November 5, 2013 @ 9:39 pm
Yes, taste is subjective. But what can be somewhat more accurately gauged is music made to appeal to the masses and be commercially successful, and music that is made to be appreciated for its artistic expression.
November 6, 2013 @ 11:28 am
I like your comment, ‘taste is subjective’ even when applied to what might be called ‘music made to appeal to the masses and be commercially successful’. I think most artists who create music would like their music to be ‘successful’, however you wish define that term. I read a comment somewhere that I’ve tried to take to heart when ever I start to negatively judge songs. ‘There is no such thing as bad art, only differing (subjective) opinions’. It helps me realize that there is an audience for all of us.